Firearm Safety for Parents – PediaCast 576

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Show Notes

Description

Judy Midkiff visits the studio as we consider firearm safety for parents. Gun-related injuries are the leading cause of death for children and teenagers in the United States… and they are almost always preventable! We explore tips for keeping kids safe at home and with friends. Tune in to learn more!

Topics

Firearm Injuries
Gun Safety

Guest

Judy Midkiff
Pediatric Nurse Practitioner
Emergency Services
Nationwide Children’s Hospital

Links

Nationwide Children’s Hospital
Emergency Services at Nationwide Children’s Hospital
Gun Safety
#SaferStorage: Preventing Child Gun Injuries
One Question Could Save A Child's Life

American Academy of Pediatrics
Guns in the Home: How to Keep Kids Safe
AAP Releases Updated Gun Violence Prevention Recommendations
Is There an Unlocked Gun Where Your Child Plays?
Gun Deaths: Urgent Public Health Crisis Affecting Children & Teens
Preventing Firearm Injuries in Children & Teens
5 Questions to Ask Before a Playdate

Be Smart for Kids (Gun Safety)
Store It Safe (AAP, Ohio Chapter)

Episode Transcript

[Dr Mike Patrick]
This episode of PediaCast is brought to you by Emergency Services at Nationwide Children's Hospital. 

Hello, everyone, and welcome to PediaCast. It is a pediatric podcast for moms and dads. This is Dr. Mike coming to you from the campus of Nationwide Children's Hospital. We're in Columbus, Ohio. It's episode 576.

We're calling this one Firearm Safety for Parents. And we do have an important topic today. It's one that could easily save the lives of many children and teenagers in the United States.

And I am not overstating that. Like, legit, this is a life-saving episode. And so right out of the gate, I'm asking you to please share this episode far and wide in your social media feeds and elsewhere so we can grab the attention of as many parents and families as possible.

The topic, as I mentioned, is firearm safety for parents. And it's particularly important because firearm injuries are now the leading cause of death in children and teenagers in the United States. It was motor vehicle accidents up until 2020.

And motor vehicle accidents, we've really put a focus on making cars safer, encouraging folks to wear seat belts, airbags, but not letting kids sit up front if the airbag could be dangerous for them based on their size. Just lots of safety features that have made driving safer. And we didn't get rid of cars.

We have some things that we do to increase the safety of folks traveling in cars, and it's made a huge difference. And so, the number of injuries and deaths from motor vehicles has gone down. That was the leading cause of death for kids and teenagers.

So now we kind of have to do the same thing for firearms and say, okay, they are important in our country. We have a culture of living with firearms, and we consider it a right in the United States. But we do need to think about safety because these firearms are killing kids and teenagers.

And in fact, they are the leading cause of death of kids and teens in the United States. So, we really do want kids to be safe. We love our children.

We love the children of our friends. And we want to prevent firearm injuries and deaths in everyone, but especially in our children. And these injuries and deaths are almost always preventable.

So, another reason why this is such an important topic. So, we are going to talk about firearm safety and the prevention of firearm injuries and deaths. We have a terrific guest joining us for this.

Judy Midkiff is a certified pediatric nurse practitioner with emergency services at Nationwide Children's Hospital. Before we get to, I do want to remind you the information presented in our podcast is for general educational purposes only. We do not diagnose medical conditions or formulate treatment plans for specific individuals.

If you're concerned about your child's health, be sure to call your health care provider. Also, your use of this audio program is subject to the PediaCast Terms of Use Agreement, which you can find at pediacast.org. So, let's take a quick break.

We'll get Judy Midkiff settled into the studio, and then we will be back to talk about firearm safety for parents. It's coming up right after this. Judy Midkiff is a certified pediatric nurse practitioner with emergency services at Nationwide Children's Hospital.

She has a passion for preventing illness and injury in children and teenagers, and that includes the prevention of firearm-related injuries. That's what she's here to talk about, firearm safety for parents. But before we dive into our topic, let's offer a warm PediaCast welcome to our guest, Judy Midkiff.

Thank you so much for stopping by the studio today.

[Judy Midkiff]
Oh, thank you for inviting me.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, we're really excited to have you here. And it turns out firearm injuries are now the leading cause of death in kids and teens. But why is there so much of it?

Why is this happening? And what can we do to prevent it?

[Judy Midkiff]
Well, that's the big key, Dr. Mike, is that we can prevent it. So, it's really important that we get out and talk about it. Part of the reason that it's happening is that we have more guns than ever right now in our communities, just for various reasons.

But that's a fact. So, it's a fact we need to talk about and address.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
So, they're out there, and so kids can get them because they're in homes. So, what are some things that we can do to prevent firearm injuries from happening?

[Judy Midkiff]
So, there's a lot of ways that parents and health care providers can help keep kids safe. The biggest one is to keep those guns out of the hands of kids. And you do that by locking them up, keeping them unloaded, keeping them in separate areas.

And we'll talk more about the details on how to do that later.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah. And I want to mention, you know, in the past, historically, and in fact, before around 2020, motor vehicle accidents were the leading cause of death in kids and teenagers. And we've really done a lot to decrease the number of deaths, you know, mostly with car safety, with seatbelt initiatives, with airbags, with not putting kids in front seats where they might be injured by the airbag.

You know, all the different things that we have done because motor vehicle accidents causing death are largely preventable as well. So now we really do need to turn our focus on how can we still, you know, be a country where we have the right to own a firearm, but we're, you know, doing it in a safe way that reduces the number of kids and teenagers who are dying from firearm related injuries. I guess it's kind of like you wouldn't just get rid of cars, you would figure out ways to have cars responsibly and to be safe, right?

[Judy Midkiff]
That's exactly right. When we put our focus on safety of children, we can make a lot of things happen. And that's just what they did with cars is put the focus on safety and the numbers have dropped down.

And that's a really important point that two things happened at the same time, is that firearm injuries went up as motor vehicle injuries went down. Yeah.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Now, there may be a lot of listeners out there who are like, well, I don't even own a gun, so why should I care about this? But really, it's something that as a community, we all should care about. Why is that?

[Judy Midkiff]
Oh, it is funny that there are a lot of folks who don't have a gun, so they don't want to talk about it. They don't want to think about it. But with so many guns in homes these days, and the latest statistics look like about 42 percent of homes have at least one gun.

Your child is going to likely encounter one at some point. So, it's really important to have that conversation with them and let them be prepared and know about it.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. I saw one statistic that like 4.6 million kids live in homes where guns are not only there, but they’re also loaded, and they're unlocked. So, like they have access to a firearm that doesn't have any sort of lock, isn't put away out of reach, and it's loaded.

4.6 million kids. And as you said, you know, over 40 percent of households have, you know, there's a gun in the house. And so even if you don't have one in your home, it's likely that your kid has a friend who does.

And if they spend time at that house, then that is a potential danger that we need to talk about and that parents need to talk to their kids about.

[Judy Midkiff]
And that's exactly why half of the unintentional or what we call accidental shootings happen in a home, often that child's home or a friend's home or a relative's home. Yeah.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, the injury and the impact of a firearm related injury, it's really more than just the injured child or the child who dies from the firearm injury. I mean, there's really a broader impact on the entire family, on the community.

Can you address that a little bit?

[Judy Midkiff]
Oh, yes. It is more anyone who's involved. So, there's a victim, someone who's been shot, and then there's someone who pulled that trigger.

So those kids suffer a serious emotional trauma from having been the one who caused the accident. It impacts their families. You know, as you said, if the child dies, that's significant loss to that family, their friends, their whole community.

You know, anytime a child dies, it has a very broad impact. But even kids who are injured will impact their family, their friends, their rehabilitation. You know, they may need to be in the hospital for a long time.

And I almost forgot to mention, you know, those of us who care for these kids, we suffer alongside of them and their families.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, absolutely. For sure. What can we do as health care providers to improve firearm safety?

I remember, gosh, it was maybe 10 years ago when Florida had a law that said medical providers couldn't even bring up the topic of firearm safety, which I find incredible, you know, because we're not talking about gun control. We're talking about how we can be safe around something that's dangerous. So, I'm glad here in Ohio, at least, that I do have an opportunity and it's OK to talk about firearm safety.

So, you know, where we can do it, what are best practices for bringing this up with families and what should we be advising them?

[Judy Midkiff]
So, you brought up a good point. That law no longer exists, and it was taken away for exactly the reason you said. This is safety.

All we're trying to do is keep kids safe. So, we not only have the right to talk to families, but it's kind of a responsibility. You know, we need to help keep them safe.

So, what we're doing right now is one of the first steps. We're providing education. We're making parents aware of how serious this situation is.

And as health care providers, you know, we don't give you advice about the flu that we just made up. You know, we do the research. We look at what things have been proven to be effective.

And then that's the advice that we pass along.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
And really, we should be passing that advice along regardless of whether there's a gun in that individual family's home. Just because they're so prevalent and because kids may visit a friend and come into contact with a gun, we want our kids to know what to do if they encounter one, right?

[Judy Midkiff]
Right. We want them to know. But also, the responsibility is not on the children.

Children have developing brains. They don't always make the right choices. Their curiosity gets the best of them sometimes.

So, we have to remind the parents that the responsibility lies with them to keep these kids safe.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
And just kind of normalizing that conversation during well checkups or, you know, however individual providers want to do that. Because there's so many things competing for attention during a very short visit. But we have to keep in mind that this is the number one leading cause of death among kids and teenagers.

So, like if you're going to prioritize one conversation over another, this one should be high up there.

[Judy Midkiff]
Yeah. And that's why I'm also expanding this. You know, we've typically put this on the primary care providers, you know, with the annual visit to kind of bring the topic up and discuss it.

But I started looking at how many children I see in a week and started thinking I should be talking about this too because I could have a huge impact on these families. So, any of us in health care can have these conversations.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. Including in the emergency department.

[Judy Midkiff]
In the emergency department, in the urgent care. Those are two of the places that I work. And people have studied this, and parents are receptive to it.

That's the other nice thing because we often think, oh, they're going to shut down if I talk about guns. But they haven't been. They have found to be receptive to our advice and actually appreciative that we're bringing it up.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. Yeah. And it makes sense that we would bring that up in emergency departments and in urgent care centers because we're professionals who may see injuries from these things, even in urgent care.

I remember I've seen kids with BB gun injuries, and it just is kind of natural, especially if a kid's coming in for an injury of any kind, you know, just to bring it up and ask about it. You know, like, what do you know about keeping it safe? You know, we're not, again, saying you shouldn't have one.

We're saying, like, how can you have one and keep kids safe, you know, when you have one at home or there's one at your friend's house.

[Judy Midkiff]
Right. And the awareness is so big. And like you said, having that conversation with parents to help them know how to ask other families, because that is an awkward conversation until you normalize it and make it part of the conversation.

I thought there was an excellent HealthyKids.org in the chat, in the links, that talks about the five questions you should ask. Guns is one of them, but there are, you know, you work it into the rest of the conversation. Are there pets?

My kid has allergies. You make it just a normal, normal chat.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And like you said, we'll put some links to resources in the show notes for this episode, 576 over at pdacast.org so folks can find those easily. Let's talk about some common myths surrounding gun safety. What are parents getting wrong about this? What's some myths and misinformation and bad advice that you may come across?

[Judy Midkiff]
One of the biggest things that I've heard from parents is, oh, my kids can't get to the gun. They don't know where it is. They can't touch it.

So, when you interview parents and ask them where they store the guns, and then you interview their kids separately, those kids know where the guns are. And over 50% of them are stored in the parents' bedroom closet. Yeah.

And those kids know that. The other one I hear very commonly is, my children know not to touch my gun. You know, yeah, I keep it in my purse, but the kids know not to touch it.

Again, we've seen multiple studies where kids have had education, they've been informed, they've been told don't ever touch a gun. And then you put them in a room with toys and an unloaded gun, and they will touch it, and they will pick it up and they will point it at each other because they're kids.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you can imagine, you know, especially when you tell someone don't do something, then, I mean, you want to communicate that message, but then there's this sense of curiosity and wonder. And, you know, you may be out, and your 12-year-old is home alone, and they know where the gun is, and they can get to it, and they just want to feel it.

They want to hold it and, you know, see, oh, it's much heavier than I was expecting. And, you know, I mean, just that curiosity. Yes.

With no, you know, no intent to harm anyone, and yet these accidents happen daily. And so, it really is something that we need to pay attention to.

[Judy Midkiff]
Yeah. And that 12-year-old might have a friend over and they're perfectly old enough to be alone, but then they decide, hey, I'm going to show you this really cool thing. And that happens so often.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. And you can understand it. Like, certainly you don't want to encourage that, but that is just part of human nature.

Like, hey, check this out, you know, and that can lead to, you know, deadly results.

[Judy Midkiff]
Exactly. And that's where it falls to the parents to keep that gun out of their hands.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
So, let's think more about that. How should parents store their firearms safely? And in particular, when, you know, the home has small children or, you know, even teenagers who you because you know your kids, you know, like you can say, oh, my kid won't do that.

But there are some kids that are more likely based on their personality. And I think parents, you know, you at least have a sense of that. It may not be 100 percent.

So, I don't want to just limit this to homes with small children, because, you know, what we're going to talk about is probably important for all homes with firearms in them.

[Judy Midkiff]
It's very much important. But starting with small kids, keep it simple. You keep your guns locked up, unloaded and keep your ammo locked somewhere else.

That's the biggest message that we can send today.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
So, the gun should be unloaded and locked up somewhere like a gun locker or, you know, a gun case that is not able to, you know, get into without knowing a combination. And then the ammunition should be locked up separate so that you really would have to get into both of those places and load the gun. Although I do want to point out that, you know, kids and teenagers who are listening to this don't assume a weapon is unloaded.

Or even if your parent tells you that it's unloaded, there may be a bullet in the chamber that you're unaware of. So, you just should really assume any firearm is loaded, whether it is or not.

[Judy Midkiff]
Yes, always assume that it is loaded and ready to go. And I think while we're talking about small kids, it's really important for parents to understand children as young as three are strong enough to pull a trigger and they know what it does.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah. There are situations where, you know, maybe a particular neighborhood is a dangerous neighborhood and guns are on the street and parents, you know, may have a sense of safety by having a loaded firearm that they can get to quickly. Is there any specific advice for those families?

Because you, I mean, again, we want to prevent these, but you can kind of also understand, like, if you live in an area where you really do fear for your safety, like that is a concern.

[Judy Midkiff]
That is a concern. And I can appreciate that parents are often keeping a gun in the house for their family's safety. But if you look at the data more often, and it is an overwhelmingly more often number, it's that family who's harmed by the gun.

So, you know, we talk about keeping it in a locked box, keeping the ammo separate. When an adult needs that gun, they are capable of getting to it, getting it loaded and being ready within minutes. It still could provide that safety when they need it.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. And you, even though you're, you have the ammunition locked up separately, you could have both of those things together. You just want that extra step of having to unlock it to get into it.

It's not like one needs to be in the bedroom and the other, the ammunition needs to be in the basement or something like that. Like, you can still have them close together where, as you said, you could get into it within a minute or so. And in most situations, you would have time to do that if you were concerned.

But, you know, again, we also have to look at risk versus benefit. And that risk of, you know, having a loaded gun that's available for kids to get to is so risky that it's just, you know, that becomes what's more likely to happen than that you're protecting your family.

[Judy Midkiff]
It is. Unfortunately, statistically, that's what we're seeing. So, you make a really good point that we're just adding an extra layer of security does not have to be in another part of the house.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah. And then as we think about our kids’ visiting friends and even relatives, I know of some pediatricians who say they would not let their kid spend time at someone else's house. Like, they just, it's like a no-go.

You know, we can all meet in a park and play, or they can come over here. But like, legit, they don't let their kids go to someone else's house, period. That seems a bit excessive to me, but I know people who do it.

What are some, I don't want to say better, but, you know, more reasonable, you know, there's a middle road here, right? How can we address gun safety in other homes that aren't ours, but we still want to keep our kids safe if they visit?

[Judy Midkiff]
So, first of all, we've talked about having that conversation with the parent. Do you have dogs? Do you have guns in the house?

And if you do, are they stored safely? Are they stored where the kids can't get to them? And then we also want to remind our kids, these are the simple steps to tell your kids regularly.

If you see a gun, don't touch it, walk away, tell an adult. I've said that kids can't be relied on, that we don't want to put the responsibility completely on them, but we still want to teach them because it gives them the power to say, oh, I know what to do in this situation.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. We've talked about young kids. Are there special considerations for teenagers when it comes to firearm safety?

[Judy Midkiff]
There are, because with teenagers, we do have the accidental shootings like, you know, hey, I want to show you this interesting thing, but we also have homicides and suicides. You know, we have kids that are getting a hold of guns and feeling like they need to carry it to school for their own safety, which is just not the way we want our kids to feel protected. And the suicide rates are unfortunately climbing, and if a firearm is used, they're 90% or better successful in their attempt.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, because it's such a massive injury. It is, yes. And you bleed out immediately, and so it is a very lethal form of, you know, self-harm.

And we do know that when there is a gun available in the house that a teenager can get to, there's a higher incidence of them using it to commit suicide. And, you know, teenagers tend to be impulsive and not necessarily, you know, the frontal cortex of their brain is not done developing, and sometimes, you know, they can make connections to events and then want to harm themselves, and then they have access to the gun. And it's just a tragedy because, you know, under different circumstances, they may not have done that.

[Judy Midkiff]
Exactly. The impulsiveness is really an important factor. But it's also, you know, on our healthcare providers to be sure that we're screening these kids for any kind of mental health issues.

Do they have any suicidal ideation? Have they talked about harming themselves or someone else? So that's part of our job is to screen for that and to watch out.

It's also important for parents to be on the lookout for any of those warning signs. A kid who is, you know, talking about harming someone else or posting on social media, it concerns me very much to see any kind of images on social media of kids with guns. You know, that just normalizes it too much and raises the risk, I think, for other kids.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, absolutely. When a teenager has what we call suicidal ideation, so we screen for this in emergency departments and urgent cares where we just say, you know, have you thought about harming yourself or have you thought about ending your life? Even if you didn't have a plan, you've just thought about it.

We know that if you have a firearm in your home when a kid has suicidal ideation that we're really concerned about that. What do you recommend in terms of like extra layers of protection if your child does have active suicidal ideation or they have a history of that? It seems like you'd want to maybe change the combinations on the lock, or should you just get the guns out of the house temporarily altogether?

What's the best advice there?

[Judy Midkiff]
This is the one time we're going to say the best advice is to get the gun out of the home. And temporarily is what we're talking about. And you say, well, how do I do that?

If you've got a trusted family member or a friend that could hold your gun, local gun shops are also an option. Law enforcement is as well, but sometimes people aren't so comfortable leaving their guns with law enforcement but go back to your local gun shop and they will often hold guns temporarily if there's a family member in trouble because they understand that it poses a greater risk and we're all just trying to keep people safe.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Now, gun safes, and as I think of these, if you go to a sporting goods store, you see them. They're large and can hold, you know, rifles and long firearms. They're also expensive.

They can run thousands of dollars. Are there more affordable options out there?

[Judy Midkiff]
So there definitely are more affordable options. Most of what are in homes these days are handguns. You can buy a simple trigger lock that it's just like a cable lock that prevents that gun from firing.

Those run pretty inexpensive. I actually had to go on Amazon just to see if what I'm saying is true, and I found a lot of simple gun safes that have a biometric lock on it, or a pin number, or a combination number, that there were several options for under $100. And there were several that were able to be mounted to the side of furniture, so if you wanted to keep it by the nightstand, you know, for easy access for a parent, those are available.

The gun safes are recommended for, you know, families who hunt. Those larger weapons, those things really don't fit anywhere else.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah. I feel like some communities, I've seen this from time to time, where like the police department will actually have like a little drive where they're offering gun boxes that are secure. Have you seen that?

[Judy Midkiff]
I have seen that, and I know that our hospital, Nationwide Children's, will often do community events where they are able to distribute lock boxes for guns. We can give them out in our urgent cares even. We've got a lot of opportunity for families who can't afford to get a safety device.

There are options for them to find them.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
And if you do have those available, it's even more important to talk to families, you know, about what the gun situation is in their home and whether they have a place to lock it up, especially if we have resources that we can provide for parents who may need them. So, in addition to safes, I think it's also important to point out that those, like the cable locks and the trigger locks, are also effective, because I would imagine that those aren't as expensive as a secure box.

[Judy Midkiff]
They are not as expensive, and often those are more available at the kind of giveaways. But they get the job done. They keep the gun from firing, which is the most important thing.

Yeah.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Well, this has been a great conversation, and I think it's a conversation, hopefully, that will extend beyond this podcast, and that parents can have the conversation within their family and amongst the parents that they hang out with, that their kids hang out, you know, with those other kids. And as you said, just to normalize the conversation about this, because it's the leading, it's the number one leading cause of death in kids and teenagers. So, we really do need to pay attention to it.

[Judy Midkiff]
And it's preventable.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yes.

[Judy Midkiff]
We can prevent this.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And, you know, it's also a touchy subject because of the history of gun ownership in our country, and how it is important to many folks in terms of, you know, freedoms. And so, there's a political thing that surrounds this.

But again, the thing that we're really after is keeping kids safe and preventing firearm injuries and deaths among kids and teens. And so, we hope that all of you hear our hearts in this, and that we are really just trying to protect families.

[Judy Midkiff]
Yeah, no one wants to see children harmed. That's the bottom line.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
We are going to have lots of resources for you in the show notes over at pediacast.org. So, we have some resources from Nationwide Children's Hospital, including stuff on gun safety, safer storage, one question that could save a child's life. We have blog posts and articles and such.

We also have a collection of links from the American Academy of Pediatrics, Guns in the Home, How to Keep Kids Safe. The AAP, or American Academy of Pediatrics, has gun violence prevention recommendations that they keep updated. We'll put a link to that.

Another one, Gun Deaths, Urgent Public Health Crisis Affecting Children and Teens. If you want to look a little bit deeper into the numbers, that'll be a good resource for you. And then also five questions to ask before a play date, which Judy, you were mentioning.

We'll put a link to that. The Ohio chapter of the American Academy of Pediatrics also has some great resources, and we'll put those links in the show notes as well. So once again, Judy Midkiff, Pediatric Nurse Practitioner with Emergency Services at Nationwide Children's Hospital.

Thank you so much for stopping by and chatting with us today.

[Judy Midkiff]
Thank you so much for having me. I'm sure we'll have this conversation many more times.

[Dr Mike Patrick]
We are back with just enough time to say thanks, once again, to all of you for taking time out of your day and making PediaCast a part of it. Really do appreciate that. Also, thank you to our guest this week, Judy Midkiff, Pediatric Nurse Practitioner with Emergency Services at Nationwide Children's Hospital.

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And that's not only physicians. We also offer credit for nurse practitioners, physician assistants, nurses, pharmacists, psychologists, social workers, and dentists. And it's because Nationwide Children's is jointly accredited by all of those professional organizations that we can offer credits that you need to fulfill your state's continuing medical education requirements.

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Simply search for FAMEcast. Thanks again for stopping by. And until next time, this is Dr. Mike saying, stay safe, stay healthy, and stay involved with your kids. So long, everybody.