Diet And Behavior, Hormones in Milk, Gardasil – PediaCast 065

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  • A Listener Rants about Diet and Behavior
  • Baby ONLY wants to nurse
  • Using Food as a Reward
  • Hormones in Milk
  • Gardasil Safety Concern



Announcer: This is PediaCast.


Welcome to PediaCast, a pediatric podcast for parents, the Listener Edition. And now direct from BirdHouse Studios, here is your host, Dr. Mike.

Dr. Mike Patrick: Hi, everyone, and welcome to PediaCast. It's Episode 65 for Friday, October 19th, 2007.

Listener Rants, Food Rewards and Gardasil. I'll explain a little bit more, specifically, in just a couple of minutes.

But first, I tell you. I'm glad it's Friday. I need a weekend, folks. [Laughter]

It's been so busy in the office with all these viruses and vomiting and diarrhea and runny nose and cough and congestion. And it's really worn me down. Ooh, I need a weekend.


And my daughter and I will be going to the Ohio State-Michigan State Big Ten Football Game at the Horseshoe. So we're excited about that.

Great fall day for it, high in the 60s, we've got the leaves on the ground. It's just beautiful. OK, I can use more sun, but that's another story.

I do want to say , I watched "Back To You" with Kelsey Grammer from "Cheers" and "Frasier". It's his new show on Fox. And we watched it because there was not a baseball game on last night. So my wife and I watched it.

There also has Patricia Heaton in it from "Everyone Loves Raymond" and that is pretty good. It's produced by Christopher Lloyd and Steve Levitan. These are the folks who brought you "Wings" and "Just Shoot Me!" and also "Frasier".

But when I see Kelsey Grammer, he had the Frasier character, both in "Cheers" and then "Frasier".


So I keep thinking it's "him" and then the way he acts with this character, of course, is different, to some degree.

But anyway, I just , well, the verdict is still out. I did enjoy my first episode all together and keep watching and let you know what I think as time goes on.

We haven't watched Grey's Anatomy at this year. I have them all TVOD on our , what I see , Time Warner DVR. It's not an official TVOD that we have anymore. But as I got into that, I know last year, we had a much smaller audience and the longer shows.

And I did Grey's Anatomy analysis and maybe we'll do that again this year. I got to start catching up on some of the old episodes.

One of the things I want to mention is, starting this week, I'm always introducing new things and then if it doesn't work, we get rid of it. But that's called "progress" [Laughter]. And what I'm doing this week is, I think, this will be more interesting, too, at a daily show.


If you go to Stickam, which is S-T-I-C-K-A-M, all of my tapings of PediaCast are going to be there. So if you wanted to watch "live" you could. Now the problem is, I can't really commit to a set time.

I'm going to aim for around seven o'clock Eastern Time most evenings, unless someone calls and that will change. But if you're on the computer and don't have anything better to do, drop by

I'll try to remember to put a link in the Show Notes to that. And just check us out. You can see what it looks like to do it live. You can send me a little message because you can text back and forth, although it will be hard for me to stay on topic and text with you.

But we could, after the show is over, if some of you were here, we probably could communicate that way for a little while, after the show.


So check that out and tell me what you think. And if you listen live then you don't have to download it either, so it gives you one advantage, I guess. Although, then we don't get the download numbers, right? [Laughter]

Stay subscribed even if you watched live. So and the name is PediaCast. Oh, that's clever. So you can look for PediaCast on Feel free to add us as a friend or you add yourself as a friend of the show.

You'll see, once you get to the site and kind of cruise around, you'll see exactly what I'm talking about. OK. So I had better get moving or this is going to be an hour-long show.

This week, we have a Listener "rant". Yes, you're allowed to have those from time to time. Also, we're going to hear from a mom who's baby only wants to nurse, doesn't want a bottle or sippy cup , anything like that.

We're going to talk about food and using it as a reward, hormones and milk.


And then, we have a teenager who has written in about an issue with Gardasil, the HPV vaccine.

Don't forget if there's a topic that you would like to discuss just go to and click on the Contact link. You can also email or call the voice line at 347-404-KIDS.

And also, don't forget the information presented in PediaCast is for general educational purposes only. We do not diagnose medical conditions or formulate treatment plans for specific individuals.

If you have a question about your child's health, call your doctor and arrange a , what am I talking about? [Laughter] , arrange a face-to-face interview and hands-on physical examination.

See what it is, folks, is the Stickam thing. Now I can see myself talking to the microphone and it's a little distracting. But I'll get used to it.

Also, your use of this audio program is subject to the PediaCast Terms of Use Agreement, which you can find at


And with all that in mind, we'll be back to answer some of your questions and listen to your comments and rants, right after this short break.

[Short Break Music]

All right, first stop with our Listener's Segment is our listener rant. [Laughter] This comes from Stacey in Houston, Texas. Stacey says , and by the way, when I use the word "rant" that's not necessarily saying it's a good thing or a bad thing. A rant is a rant. So this is a rant then maybe I'll agree with. We'll see.


Stacey in Houston says, "Dear Dr. Mike, I just finished listening to Episode number 47. Yes, I'm a little behind. And I was a bit frustrated with the answer to 'Does Candida yeast affect behavior?'

"I believe there is an enormous lack of research on the way diet affects the body. To me, it sounded like you were saying the information was incorrect simply because someone was trying to sell something."

"I do agree that the product probably don't help much, and of course, there's probably no more research to support the product's claims. But I don't think your answer was a scientifically proper way to prove a hypothesis." Ouch!

"I do believe diet can affect seemingly subjective things like behavior. Excess Candida along with other things that people may be intolerant to can greatly affect our bodies in ways that cannot be measured by a blood test."

"Unfortunately, scientific research tends to study things that can only be quantitatively measured and most MDs treat based on positive research only."


"I'm a physical therapist and also follow a mostly evidence-based practice, but there are tools to help objectify behavior. It tends to not be a popular subject to study. Much of our countries research comes from drug companies and they're not really interested in researching the effects of diet."

That's a partially good point. There is a lot of research that takes place in academic institutions that is not supported by drug companies. But you're right, when it comes to medicine. A lot of the studies are. So it is a good point.

"There has been recent awareness that Candida overgrowth, gluten and dairy can adversely affect those with autism and ADD."

I might argue with you about the validity of those studies and how well they were done but that's another story.

"But very little scientific research has been dedicated to it." Yes, that's true. "A few years ago, I had suspected that gluten had been the problem with me."


"I stopped eating it and , voila , my GI problems went away." But again you noticed, your GI problems went away, not necessarily your behavior problems, of course, if you have a stomach ache all the time, then that may affect your behavior, but not in a direct fashion.

"I finally got to see a gastro Doc who told me gluten sensitivity was very rare but current research says 1 in 133 people have it. He tested me even though I had been gluten-free for a couple of months. Of course, it came up mostly negative."

"The diagnosis is left to the experience and interpretation of the pathologist and is not quantitative. The gastro Doc said even if I did have it, the diet is too restrictive that I shouldn't bother."

I'm glad I didn't listen to him. Please reconsider looking at diet and other not-so-proven cures even though they have not been scientifically or statistically, significantly, proven yet.


"Please don't discredit a hypothesis just because the right study has not been done yet. Remember, we can't prove something doesn't exist. We can only prove that something does exist. I do believe that Candida overgrowth can affect behavior in some cases."

I'm still going to disagree with there.

"There are a couple of related but obscure studies done and much more needs to be examined. I really enjoy your podcast especially the ones where someone stirs up some controversy. But hey, if we all agreed with each other life would be pretty boring. Thanks for reading." And that comes from Stacey in Houston.

So thanks for your comments, Stacey. You do bring up some good points. And we should all keep in mind that much of our current knowledge and what we learned and how we practiced medicine is not necessarily what was known or taught or practiced 20 to 30 years ago.

So there will be new discoveries based on sound science that change the way we think about many areas of medicine. And who knows maybe diet and its relation to behavior will be one of those areas so only time will tell.


OK. Let's move on to Mykah from Western New York. And Mykah says, "Dear Dr. Mike, thanks for doing this podcast. I've listened to every episode. I usually listen at work. And since you put a humorous spin on every topic, my Cuban mates often asked "Are you listening to the 'poopy' doctor again?" when they hear me snicker because I've told them about your 'pooped' podcast episodes."

"Anyhoo, I have a question regarding feeding my eight-month old. He is on salads, cereal, homemade fruits and vegetables and yogurt, while still being breastfed at home and getting expressed milk in bottles at day care."

"Last week, he started refusing the bottle so he is only getting whatever milk is mixed in his cereal, the water in his foods and whatever he gets from nursing. We've tried silicone and hard-spouted sippy cups, regular cups and even straws with milk water and water with a smidge of juice in it. And he hates and refuses it all."


"He will only nurse and will occasionally take a couple of slugs from his silicone-spouted cup. It worries me especially this week, since he came down with a cold that included a mild fever and a runny nose that could beat out Flo Jo in the 100-meter dash."

[Laughter] "He's only nursing in the morning, at lunch, because I do go to see him at lunch, and at home. Is that enough fluids for the day for an eight-month old?"

'I've asked our pediatrician and they said they would be concerned if he didn't have a wet diaper in 12 hours. Occasionally he will go around four hours without a wet diaper. He's definitely fine in between feedings, but he is not quite ready to be weaned yet."

"Any thoughts would be appreciated. And to put my mind at ease, the little guy is fine. It's me that needs convincing. Thanks in advance."

Well, thank you for your question, Mykah. It sounds to me like you have a stubborn kid on your hands. Those are common, by the way.

So how much fluid is the right amount?


You have to look at the whole picture and this is what your pediatrician am sure has done. You've looked at how well hydrated the kid looks. You look at their growth, you look at their urine output and that's the best way to know if it's enough, rather than a number of ounces that a child should be taking during the day or how many times he should be feeding.

And I'm sure your pediatrician has taken all that into account even if he didn't tell you that he was doing that specifically. So I would trust his or her opinion. I mean, if a kid is well hydrated, they look good on their growth chart, they're growing well, they're making good diapers, and if your child is having a diaper every four hours, that's certainly plenty.

Then I won't worry about it. And I trust what your doctor says and stop worrying.

Next stop is Heather and Heather says, "Hi. I just love your show." Heather by the way didn't say where she was from. So, don't forget if you write in, especially if you're writing on the Contact form at, there's a place there to put where you're from.


And so most people don't forget, but if you email and send me your question that way, make sure you'll let me know where you're from because I think people are interested to hear where folks are in the world , where our audience is spread.

So Heather says, "Hi. I just love your show. I'm a faithful listener of Dan and Kerry's Baby Time and was introduced to your show when she had you on their podcast. I have a question. What are your thoughts on using "food" as a reward, such as giving an M&M while potty training every time your child goes potty on the 'big girl' potty or the 'big boy' potty?"

"Or event this, if you finished your vegetables, you can have some ice cream. Growing up, I was rewarded with food, a banana split, after acing a test. And now as I struggle with weight, I find myself rewarding myself for a job well done with a sweet treat."

"I'd hate for my daughter to fall into the same trap, but the M&M tricks seem so popular with parents these days."


"Thanks for taking the time to read my question and I look forward to hearing your answer." And that's Heather.

Heather, first let me say, Dan and Kerry from the Baby Time podcast are great. They have a wonderful podcast. I love listening to it. And there is a link to their program up with that in the Show Notes. So if you've not heard of the Baby Time podcast. You should definitely check that out.

When my kids were toddlers, we used to joke that our lives revolved around bribes, threats and lies. [Laughter] When you bribe, you're basically using a reward system. You're saying, "If you do X, I will give you Y." And there's nothing inherently wrong with that.

Even as adults, we do it. We just call them "goals" that we're working toward. When you have a goal that you are working for, it's because you want that goal. So if you do X, you're going to get Y. So we still bribe ourselves all the time, right?

Now, in order for it to work, the bribe has to be motivating, I mean, it has to be something that you want and you're willing to work for.


For some people, occasionally that's going to be food and for other it's not. I do see your concern with the childhood obesity problem. I think, overall, the thing that we have to evoke here is the "moderation" principle. I mean a few M&Ms for going to the potty is fine. But does going potty gets you have the bag? No!

A banana split for acing a test is great, but not if you're acing a test twice a week. I'd say, rather than saying that all food rewards are bad, it's better to say, I think, that you have a variety of rewards, not bribes.

Sometimes it's going to be food, sometimes not, and we're not going to overdo any of them. That's the moderation principle and very important, in my opinion. So I hope that helps.

And next stop is Stephanie in Cedar Rapids, Iowa. Stephanie says, "I am a huge fan of the show, 30 weeks pregnant with my first two. Yes, twin boys, I'm kidding my info ahead of time."


'In your recent PediaCast number 57 , anemia, breast milk and herpes , you responded to one of the questions about non-organic cow's milk and the hormones contained in it. Your response was something like 'Hormones in the cow's milk would be destroyed in the stomach and intestine.'"

"My initial reaction was that we take birth control pills and other hormones that are absorbed in our intestinal tract that obviously aren't destroyed, or they wouldn't work. So isn't that evidence that the hormone in cow's milk would in fact be transferred to the person drinking it?"

Stephanie, I love the fact that you're thinking, I mean rather than just blindly taking my word for this. You are using what you already know, taking that next step to think about it. But what you're forgetting is that hormones that we take as oral medication are packaged in pill form, and the hormone is inside the pill-like cargo.


And the shell protects it as it traverses the stomach and the upper portion of the small intestine, where most of the digestive enzymes are and where most of that takes place. So the pill itself protects the hormone and gets it through that dangerous area to a place where it can absorb and then going to your body.

But, again, I like the fact that this question popped into your head as you listened to the show. Meaning, too often, we take what we read or hear is truth without really thinking about it and asking questions. So kudos to Stephanie in Cedar Rapids.

OK. And finally, we have Janet from Newberg, Oregon. Janet says, "I was wondering. Last May, I went to my doctor to get the second round of the Gardasil shot. When I got there, the nurse told me they were not giving it out at this time because some bad side effects were coming forth.

"And they would call when it was being given again. She hasn't called yet. I never saw my doctor that day or was even told what was wrong with the shot."


"Even after asking I was told 'Oh, it's a bunch of science stuff.' On the side note, this has influenced my decision to change doctors."

"So my question is, have you heard of this recall or anything about it? P.S. Just to give you some info. I'm 15, 16 in a couple of weeks and a junior in high school. My doctor is a pediatrician or at least was." Was her doctor, probably he's still a pediatrician.

"I love your show and it gives me so much info. I loved it when you and Jamie at the MedicCast met up for the interview. Thanks for all you do."

Well, thanks for listening, Janet. And I mentioned a Baby Time. I probably should mention the MedicCast as well. Jamie and I did a discussion on pediatric sports injuries and that was in MedicCast number 86. And I'll put a link to that in the Show Notes.

Jamie basically does a podcast aimed at paramedics and EMTs and other pre-hospital rescue people.


I'm sure I'm not using the right terminology there. [Laughter] And I apologize, Jamie. Pre-hospital personnel and it's something like that.

Anyway, the guys , the rescue squad people , so he has a podcast geared toward them. And I was a guest on MedicCast 86, and we talked about pediatric sports injuries. So you might want to check that out.

I have not heard of any issues with Gardasil. I mean we're using it in our office and if there are issues with it, we almost always hear them immediately. I'm on a mailing list from the American Academy of Pediatrics and the CDC and usually that's the first place I hear. And then, of course, it's in the news and parents talk about it; the drug company lets us know.

So usually we hear. I have not heard any issues specifically. We do see a lot of reactions with Gardasil, as we do with all the shots because remember the way shots work is, it's an antigen. You're fooling your body into thinking that you have that particular disease.


In this case, it's the HPV virus. It's not a live virus. It's just, basically, a protein that looks like , it may not be a protein. It could be like a polysaccharide or something. But it's a chemical. It's some molecule that fakes your body into thinking that it is the virus and then we inject that, then you have an immune reaction.

So the body says, "Hey, this shouldn't be here." It makes antibodies against it, so the next time that it sees that molecule, it can attack and get rid of it very, very quickly. So that's how immunizations work.

But in order for them to work, your body has to fight this thing that were faking it into thinking it's the real disease and that cause swelling and warmth, and fever and aches and pains, and all those things.

My daughter did get the Gardasil vaccine. It's been a few months ago now and she did complain that it hurts. She's not really looking forward to getting the second and third one. But they say, "no pain, no gain". So I mean, it's just one those things.


Now I'm more concerned that you asked a question. Why? What's going on? And the answer you get is , it's a bunch of science stuff? I mean that is just insulting. That's not cool at all. I mean, you deserve having the science stuff explained in a way that you can understand it. Of course, that's sort of a passion of mine doing this podcast.

Of course, I can explain what it was that they were talking about since I don't know exactly what's going on in your office. But again I can tell you. It's on the market. We're giving it and I've heard of no recalls or problems with it at all.

Maybe their batch was recalled and they had to turn it back in. Maybe they left it out of the refrigerator. Maybe they weren't getting reimbursed for it by certain insurance companies. And it gets expensive to buy this stuff and then not getting reimbursed for it as a physician.

And maybe they stopped giving it temporarily until the insurance companies come around and start paying for it. That's possible, too.


All right. I hope that helped, Janet. And again, thanks for listening.

OK. We are going to take a quick break and we'll come back to wrap things up and since you ended the weekend, right after this.

[Short Break Music]

All right. Thanks go out to all of you for stopping by and making us a part of your week. It's really appreciated.

Also thanks go out to Vlad over at for providing the art work for us. And of course, thanks go out to my family, as I say, pretty much every day because it's so important because they really have to put up with a lot.


My wife right now is with my daughter at play practice. She's going to be in high school musical in Columbus Ohio in December and already they're having rehearsals for it. And I can't really help out after-work by taking Katie to her rehearsals because I've got to get PediaCast stuff done.

And so what does my son do while my I'm doing this? He was upstairs playing the Wii. So you don't get dad-and-son time like you probably should because of this.

So thanks go out to them for putting up and we're going to have a good weekend this weekend. We've got a football game. We're going to have some place in Muker. We'll have fun.

So let me also just say, no one stopped by Stickam. [Laughter] This entire show I've been in the little chat room all by myself. It's kind of echoing in here. And I didn't really expect anyone to be here because it's a big site.

There's lots of people to look at and listen to.


But please, if you're not doing anything in the evenings next week, try around sometime between seven and eight o'clock in the evening. It's the most likely time that you'll catch me at

It's going to vary a little bit, depending on the schedule. But if you're not doing anything, stop by and check it out.

Don't forget, if you have not given us a review in iTunes that would be very appreciated.

So everybody have a great weekend. I'm going to say, "Go Buckeyes, beat the Spartans" and hopeful that will come true." [Knocking on Wood] They're going to knock on wood, too.

So until next time, which will be Monday, so everybody have a wonderful weekend.

This is Dr. Mike saying, stay safe, stay healthy and stay involved with your kids, even if you're doing a podcast.

So long, everybody!

[End Music]

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